Carrier Vetting Best Practices: How To Protect Your Freight From Fraud With Danielle Spinelli
- Apr 5
- 36 min read
Danielle Spinelli is the Director of Partnerships at GenLogs, a logistics technology company that helps brokers, carriers, and shippers combat fraud and improve supply chain visibility. With over a decade of experience in the logistics industry, she has experience in carrier vetting, compliance, and cargo theft prevention. Before joining GenLogs, Danielle spent eight years as a carrier sales broker. She is also the host of the Tell Me Everything podcast, where she educates and connects professionals across the supply chain while raising awareness about fraud trends.
Here's a glimpse of what you’ll learn:
[3:05] The origin of the Tell Me Everything podcast and its focus on learning across all areas of logistics
[5:33] Danielle Spinelli’s career path from telecom sales into freight brokerage and high-value cargo specialization
[9:34] Key characteristics differentiating great brokers, including relationships, transparency, and communication
[11:01] How modern fraud tactics have evolved and the importance of deeper verification like VIN checks
[15:03] Why outdated vetting processes fail and the danger of relying solely on technology without human judgment
[21:17] Danielle shares her experience learning about rail cargo theft while working with law enforcement
[26:48] Tech stack collaboration and combining tracking data with real-world truck verification
[34:05] The value of conversational podcasting versus traditional interview styles
[40:33] Danielle talks about networking and relationship-building outside formal conference sessions
In this episode…
Fraud in logistics isn’t just about stolen goods anymore — it’s evolving into something far more sophisticated and difficult to detect. With bad actors becoming more strategic and technology advancing rapidly, even experienced professionals can struggle to keep up. How can companies stay ahead when the rules keep changing?
According to fraud-prevention and carrier-vetting expert Danielle Spinelli, it starts with combining human intuition and technology. Relying solely on automation is a mistake. Instead, teams should combine tools with genuine conversations, such as calling drivers to validate legitimacy. Building strong relationships and maintaining transparency with partners can also reduce risk when issues arise. Additionally, using layered verification methods — like checking VIN-level data and monitoring behavioral patterns — helps uncover red flags that basic checks might miss. A proactive, relationship-driven approach strengthens both security and operations.
In this episode of The Tao of Pizza Podcast, Mark Hiddleson talks with Danielle Spinelli, Director of Partnerships at GenLogs and the host of Tell Me Everything, about combating modern logistics fraud. Danielle shares evolving fraud tactics and verification methods, the importance of relationships and transparency in brokerage, and how integrating multiple data sources improves visibility and risk prevention.
Resources mentioned in this episode:
Specialized Storage Solutions, Inc. contact phone: 707-732-3892
Mark Hiddleson's email: markhiddleson@aol.com
Quotable Moments:
“I think the biggest thing is just like you mentioned…having that relationship first and then also being full transparency.”
“I really think the biggest thing that most of us are messing up on in the industry is relying heavily on tech.”
“Tech’s not going to save us, and people that think that is crazy; it needs human intervention.”
“You never know who ends up where and when, and people like the relationship piece on every part of business.”
“Nobody has a silver bullet; it really takes all the different vetting platforms and technologies to work together.”
Action Steps:
Combine technology with human verification: Relying only on automation can create blind spots that fraudsters exploit. Adding human checks — like calling drivers — helps validate legitimacy and catch issues early.
Build strong, transparent relationships with partners: Open communication makes it easier to handle problems when they arise. Trust-based relationships also improve collaboration and reduce risk across the supply chain.
Use layered carrier vetting processes: Looking beyond basic checks — such as incorporating VIN-level data and behavior patterns — uncovers hidden red flags. Multiple verification layers make it harder for bad actors to slip through.
Avoid siloed systems by integrating data sources: Combining insights from multiple platforms creates a more complete operational picture. This “fortress” of information improves decision-making and fraud prevention.
Continuously challenge outdated assumptions: Fraud tactics evolve quickly, so relying on old rules can lead to costly mistakes. Regularly updating processes ensures your strategy stays effective in a changing landscape.
Sponsor for this episode:
This episode is brought to you by Specialized Storage Solutions Inc.
Listen...
I have been in the logistics and storage industry for several decades. I know I don’t look that old, but it's true.
We provide industry-leading warehouse storage solutions nationwide.
So basically, if you have a warehouse that needs Rack, Shelving, Carts, Conveyors, or Mezzanines, we help with....design engineering, installations, inspections, and repairs to help clients optimize their logistics operations.
Sometimes people don’t even realize that we can actually help with permit acquisition services.
We take a holistic look at your entire business supply chain ecosystem to develop the resources for continually improving your operation.
To learn more, visit specialracks.com or give us a call at (707) 732-3892. One of the best ways to learn more about our products and services is to follow us on Instagram. And there’s a link on our website to do that.
I will even give you my personal email address for podcast listeners, so email me at markhiddleson@aol.com if you’re ready to take your warehouse storage and retrieval systems to the next level.
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Episode Transcript:
Intro 0:00
Welcome to The Tao of Pizza, where we feature top logistics leaders, entrepreneurs and supply chain innovators and share their inspiring stories with a holistic twist.
Mark Hiddleson 0:14
Mark Hiddleson here, host of The Tao of Pizza Podcast, where I talk with top industry innovators in the warehousing, logistics and supply chain business with a holistic twist. Now, before I introduce today's guest, this episode is brought to you by Specialized Storage Solutions, Inc. Now listen, I've spent decades building warehouse systems that actually work, and after conversations with clients and peers at Manifest in Las Vegas, one thing's clear, innovation only matters when it shows up on the warehouse floor. A Specialized Storage Solutions. We provide industry leading warehouse storage solutions nationwide if you have a facility that needs racking, shelving, carts, conveyors or mezzanines, we help across the full life cycle, design, engineering, installation, inspections and repairs all focused on real throughput, real people and real constraints. And here's something many folks don't realize, we also offer permanent acquisition services. Yes, we handle the red tape so you don't have to. We take a holistic view of your entire supply chain ecosystem, blending physical infrastructure with modern thinking around automation, flow and adaptability to help our clients continuously improve, not just install and move on to learn more, visit our website or give us a call. And just for podcast listeners, I'll even give you my personal email. Markhiddleson@aol.com. Yes, I still use AOL, and yes, I'm proud of it. If you're ready to design warehouse systems built for where the industry is going, not just where it's been, drop us a line, but today, we're joined by Danielle Spinelli, known across the industry as the fraud girl, and trust me, that's the title you want on your side, Danielle is the host of the Tell Me Everything podcast where she pulls back the curtain on fraud, carrier vetting and the realities of modern logistics. With over a decade in transportation, including eight years as a carrier sales broker, she's been in the trenches, building carrier relationships, navigating compliance and spotting red flags before they become costly problems. Today, Danielle brings that experience to GenLogs as their Director of Partnerships, where she helps brokers and shippers properly vet carriers and protect their operations from fraud. She's also a member of the TIA cargo theft Task Force and was honored as a 2024 women in logistics award recipient recognition well deserved for someone who turns complexity into clarity and risk into readiness. If you care about trust, transparency and protecting the supply chain, you're about to learn a lot. Danielle, welcome to the pizza.
Danielle Spinelli 2:52
Hey. Thanks much for having me.
Mark Hiddleson 2:54
Yeah. So I would love to share a little bit more about your podcast. When I found out it was telling me everything, I was shocked to learn it was about freight.
Danielle Spinelli 3:06
Well, I know it's funny, so I actually, the idea kind of came up last not this manifest, last year's manifest, I was there, and, you know, think walking in being like, Oh yeah, I know logistics. Like, I know all the things. I walked in, and I'm like, wow, I don't know anything, because it's such a huge conference, and there's so many different areas of supply chain, and so that's kind of where the idea came from. It told me everything I wanted to know, all the different things about logistics. And then I do fraud girl Fridays, which is kind of like where I have all my knowledge on things, so I can share that part of it with the industry on Fridays, but on Tuesday I get to learn. So that's kind of my two little episodes within my podcast, but, yeah, awesome.
Mark Hiddleson 3:43
And hosting a podcast about three or four years ago, and I had no idea, like I had learned from watching podcasts, but so much from hosting. Yeah, because it's a benefit that you know, I did. I started a podcast to connect with, like my top 200 clients, referral partners, in a way to give them a contribution. How much I've learned? So what's, what's something you've learned that you had no idea? Like a, like a Satori aha moment from, from the podcast.
Danielle Spinelli 4:14
Honestly, I've learned so much just from different people in the different industries. So I did one with Julie Davis, and she does trade compliance, and like, you know, international supply chain. And she was teaching me all the like, fraud and thefts that they deal with on, like, trade compliance and like, where, like, fake companies will start up, and, like, you know, buy products, or they'll return fake products, and just like, all of that complexity. And I, you know, I'm only in my life, over the road stuff, and that's kind of all the things that I see. So I learned a lot there. And then I just did an episode with overhaul, and they were teaching me about how in Europe, that's kind of the next thing that they're thinking cargo that's going to hit is them, because most of the bad actors are over there, and so kind of like sleeper cell feel like that's going to happen over there. So they like projecting that to be hit. Next, they're starting to see early signs of it. So crazy. But you know, on top of that, outside of, like, the cargo theft stuff, which is the stuff that I love the most, but just learning, I love talking to different people like, you know, logistics or industry specialists, and just learning, like, how do they become successful? How are they continuing to have success and keep building? That's helped me just in my own career growth. So it's been pretty
Mark Hiddleson 5:21
cool, awesome. So tell us a little bit about things like, where you're from, your background, and what led to getting into the logistics business.
Danielle Spinelli 5:33
So, born and raised in Minnesota, you know, they go all the way back, perfect and so, born and raised in Minnesota, my parents moved me down here when I'm in Georgia now, when I was middle of high school, so 1516, and just kind of loved it ever since I got to deal with winter, so it's amazing. I started off in telecommunication, and I was in a call center and in sales there. One of my girlfriends was like, after like, 10 years of working there, they were like, hey, you know, come over to the logistics side. You'll make a lot more money, and little did, I know, a lot less sleep. And so I just moved over to being a broker. Started off with postal work that literally keeps you up all the time. And during peak season, or November, December, you literally don't sleep. And you work, you know, 90 hours a week is insane. Right after peak, my first peak season, pretty much I left and then went to a new brokerage, and I specialized in copper and electrical wire. So I did a lot of, like, high value freight, which is what led me to need to be really well, really good at a Carrier wedding, because I had some thefts. Like, a lot of it was straight thefts. Like, somebody would go to a truck stop and help my stop and help by gunpoint, unfortunately, and that type of stuff. But then, kind of, as the world has shifted, kind of after 2020 we saw a lot more of the fraudulent guys, and the guys are very deceptive or strategic theft, they call it. So I really had to learn a lot from there. And then one of the programs we were using was my care portal. So came on board on the tech side and was able to do a lot of education and speaking there, and helped that product a lot. And then just just recently, like, just announced, uh, moved over to GenLogs. So being able to take that even a step further with helping with cargo theft, awesome.
Mark Hiddleson 7:15
So I had a career in sales. I had a similar experience when I was in college. I was mowing lawns and stuff and then I did this interview to sell magazines over the phone. Oh, yeah, it was a script. And I was just like, they gave you a script. I'm like, I can read the script and I could dial a phone speaker. It was just a numbers game, right? It's like, yeah, how many calls? And one thing I learned there, and that a lot of people didn't get this, is, you wanted the objections run through the script so they like, I don't have to get objections. Gonna slow me down. It's like, no, that's where, because that's the fun part, yeah. And that's really, you know, find out, and that's where really. So it didn't, I didn't do that very long, because, like, talk for about an hour. I mean, you just get tired and people are hanging up on you. Oh, I'm sure, but you do. I learned sales, and it's just like I was going into engineering and everything. And I'm like, you know, I want to do something and involve sales, because I like it so much. So if you work for a broker, you're calling. A lot of people are like, we get calls all the time, yeah, from there's one company that's famous for it is
Danielle Spinelli 8:21
a TQL. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. They're also posted all over the love board. Don't call the carriers, say, "Don't call me if you're TQL. But no, they're, I mean, they're a big company, and I'm sure they're great. I never worked for them, but yeah, it's fun being a broker, because you definitely have the sales side of it as super fast pace sales. So it's a little bit different, like, I think of sales as like an art form. So like being a broker, you have to be super quick and churn and burn and, you know, know as soon as it's going to be a no and move on to the next call, but it's, it's fun. So those objections are especially whenever you're desperate for a driver and you're like, giving up your first born to have them pick up a load for you. You become really good at overcoming objections. Yes.
Mark Hiddleson 9:04
So share a little bit about how, like, what differentiates. Because we have, I have somebody called Tammy BTB, and she's like, the best of the best. And we've been like, I'm a relationship person. Like, you get going when we've had people that were terrible and, like, they don't get the right contact information, that don't follow up. It's so tell me, like, what? What differentiates your likes, what differentiates a service level for somebody who's great at that?
Danielle Spinelli 9:33
I think the biggest thing is, just like, you mentioned having that relationship first, and then also being full transparency. Like, if something does happen, I mean, it's trucking, things do happen all the time. Bad stuff happens all the time. If you're being honest and forward about it, and not just trying to hide it, and like, hopefully they don't notice it, will make delivery and, you know, stuff like that. It makes a big difference when you're actually dealing with a crisis and kind of having your, you know, shipper involved, and then just that relationship. A piece of it where, you know, I'm not just a number, and you're not just a number, I actually have a good relationship with you. I care about your free time and also, it kind of shows you, like, you know, if I care about you, I care more about your business, too, and vice versa. So I think that's, you know, key really, in any part of, any part of the industry,
Mark Hiddleson 10:18
yeah, especially with the new tech that's coming out. I was there. I was at the manifest, with the client. I like to go with my clients, because I get their perspective. They run a warehouse. So our clients, you know, usually run warehouses. We do a lot, and they have trucks. I mean, the thing is, everything is connected to everything. That's what you were saying in your podcast. It's the phrase, it affects the three. Pl is because they're the ones checking compliance. And then what happens with a truck comes up as a guy, and I learned this at manifest, a truck could pull up with the right stickers, the right license plate, the driver's ID passes everything, and it's the wrong truck. Is that one of the evolving patterns, when I looked at your podcast website, was like, these are the evolving patterns of fraud. I mean, I just thought it was people making mistakes, like, not
Danielle Spinelli 11:01
No well, and that happens too, but it is where these guys are getting really sophisticated. And as like, especially for high value freight, those shippers and manufacturers, like, they are checking everything. So you have to meet all, you know, cross, all the T's, dot, all the i's, and so they are checking everything. And so a lot of times what they'll miss is, like, Vin level information. So like, for instance, when I worked at my care portal, we did a lot of Vin verification. So a lot of times the VIN is where you can really get the real information on that truck, and who it actually belongs to, and things like that. And, you know, fake CDLs and stuff like that happen all the time. But nowadays, like I worked with the California Highway Patrol, and as long as that face matches a CDL, you at least have a face, and they can do facial recognition to try to find them. But most of the time, unfortunately, like, once a load actually gets stolen, it, like, a lot of times it's gone with the wind. So having additional pieces where you have, like palette tracking, or, you know, even like how Jen logs has, like their cameras everywhere, and you can kind of search things up. You know, there's certain ways that you can try to find and make recoveries. But unfortunately, recoveries are, it's a very small percentage that, you know, actually get recovered.
Mark Hiddleson 12:05
But so yeah. So share a little bit about the GenLogs camera system, because I just, I just learned about that at manifest, and then you were sure before, before the interview.
Danielle Spinelli 12:16
So it's so funny. I honestly like it, so I nerd out over anything new that helps prevent cargo theft, like, so I saw them, like, two years ago. It was just whenever they're starting to come up, and they just started their network of cameras, and it was mainly in the southeast. I'm like, well, this doesn't expand far enough. Like, wait till you guys get bigger than you know, I'll talk. I'll start promoting a product just like my customers. And so then last year, they've been able to, like, really make a huge network, make a huge difference in their network. And so then I got them to integrate on the partnership side with my care portal. So now we can see, like, that insight in the carrier vetting to be like, have they actually been seen on the road? Because that's kind of the biggest thing. Like, like, they can actually act like they have a truck, or they can go through inspections and have like, a, you know, rental pin ski truck or whatever, and do the inspection. But do they really have a real truck? Like, is this really a person? And so genlux can see all of that, and see them on the roads, which is huge. So not only that, like on a prevention of cargo theft, but they even use their for, like, capacity and stuff like that, and try to build your network out and that way, you know, like, Hey, I'm calling carriers that actually have trucks, and they're not just like dat rats, for instance. So I know it's pretty cool. It's cool to be a part of something that I think is really like next level on being able to actually make a difference and stop cargo theft, because it's really where my passion is at.
Mark Hiddleson 13:33
So, yeah, I can tell them, that's why you're the fraud girl. Are you really the frog girl? And you're like, I know
Danielle Spinelli 13:41
it's so not, not like fraud. Somebody was like, You should be called the anti frog girl. It's not as catchy, but that's essentially what it is. It's not, I'm not committing fraud. I'm trying to stop fraud, but she stole the whole choo choo train. Yeah, yeah. It's funny because So Scott Cornell, he's with now. He's with logistic, but he was with travelers for many years. He's kind of like the head honcho. I come the king of cargo theft, because he knows all the stuff. He's so funny because he's like, it's not necessarily fraud all the time. It's more cargo theft. I'm like, well, cargo theft girl doesn't sound as interesting as fraud girl either. So and it
Mark Hiddleson 14:17
still sounds like you're stealing cigarettes off the back, exactly. I like the flag girl and the tell me everything, because that's a kid. What was Scott's last name?
Danielle Spinelli 14:27
Cornell. Cornell. Do an introduction. He's you would love him. He's amazing, yeah. And anytime
Mark Hiddleson 14:33
I do show notes with the podcast, anytime we mentioned someone, I like to put their LinkedIn, at least put their LinkedIn, and then, yeah, company. So make sure we give Scott a shout out. So there was, there was a couple other so what are, what are some share some ideas about broken processes, outdated assumptions and hard truths about this business. Because I think, I think that's kind of where the tell me everything comes in, because people don't want to tell you, that's other thing about objections in sales. You. People don't want to tell you where all the dead bodies are buried?
Danielle Spinelli 15:03
Totally, yeah. And there's a lot of outdated processes out there, period, I mean, like, with, and I'll just, I guess, focus on, like, the cargo theft stuff, because that's just kind of, like my niche. But on that front, like, let's say they have no inspections, that's been a big thing for a long time, where they said, hey, if they have no inspections, that means they're not legitimate. Kind of like I just mentioned, they're renting pin ski trucks and driving through a station or trying to get inspected. So a lot of times, whenever we come out with something, and especially, especially whenever we post it all on LinkedIn, and be like, Hey, this is how you bet a carrier, and this is your yes or no answer, then they learn that, and they're like, Okay, well, we'll adapt to do this and that. So there's a lot of different layers. I think that need to come into place. But I really think the biggest thing that most of us are messing up on in the industry is relying heavily on tech, and thinking that tech is going to solve everything. And it's not like it. Nobody has a silver bullet. If they did, we wouldn't have cargo theft. We we still deal with it. It's actually growing since we've had had more, you know, tech out there. So I think Tech's not going to save us. And people that think that is crazy. I think it needs to take human, human, you know, intervention, human, talking to them, building a relationship. That piece of it is so essential. Tech's there to enhance it, make it faster, bring out more red flags and what you can see as a human. But you have to have that human, you know, piece in it, woven in, even though we're moving fast, even though we're trying to move right out the door and not think about anything else that you got to pause and be like, Okay, let me call this driver and see if he sounds legit. I mean, that makes such a difference. And can't even tell you how many times that's helped me whenever I was a rep, like, actually prevent theft.
Mark Hiddleson 16:35
So, yeah, so broken processes of just not following even the paper, that's one of the things I believe, too, about automation is just going to magnify, like, if you have systems that don't work, if you have processes virtually, you don't have the right people, and you don't have the right process, the tech is just going to exponentially, like, totally expose it and multiply, amplify it. And so building those systems, even I know a lot of our and it's high stress, high movement. We have customers. They have 3050, Doctor words, and they're doing 10 or more trucks a day, every day, at each door. So how, when you're developing, when you're in the developing partnerships with GenLogs, what kind of partners, what kind of partners? What kind of relationships are you looking to build?
Danielle Spinelli 17:24
Really, we're working with other tech partners, which is super fun, because being able to share data, like, either they have data that our customers could use, or we have data most of the time, is that GenLogs has data that everybody else wants, because they're the newest and shiniest thing, I think. But you know, mutual customers being able to see that like, where they actually live at because a lot of times they don't actually of times they don't actually go into, like, another UI or another website, or like, living in their TMS or living in their vetting solution or whatever. And so that's kind of mainly what I'm doing, is that piece of it, like, how, how will customers actually use a product? And then how can we make that be like a fortified fortress of information, where you have so many different angles. I think another big thing too, that's going on in the industry is some people are so siloed in their own tech, and they can't think about outside of their own thing. They think they're the best and they're the only solution out there, and you're not, like I said, nobody has a silver bullet. So it's it really takes all the different vetting platforms and all the different technologies to work together to make that
Mark Hiddleson 18:20
fortress All right. So I have some I wanted to I was hoping I could do this, and you segue right into it. So learn some things that manifest. You know me. So I'm like, I've been in this industry for 30 years. So like when you said you thought, you know everything always going and I know everything. I'm always like, wow, I can they were talking about things like tech stack, and I was like, Well, isn't tech stack like the 10 laptops that I've had over the course of my tech stack, they're right here, WMS, TMS, ERP, all those systems. And then, like you said, you know, people get siloed, or they serve that they're the TMS expert or their ws expert, and their solution touches everything, because it has to. But there is no one size fits all right solution. So I met a couple. I want to ask you, if you've heard of Have you heard of Gnosis? No, P, N, O, S, I S. So they follow up with me after manifest, and their company is they have information about your freight if you say you're doing theirs was container. It's container life cycle management. And I was telling I was kept saying it's container lifestyle management. Lifestyle management,
Danielle Spinelli 19:33
this, this container goes out to the bars this container.
Mark Hiddleson 19:36
So it's a lifestyle that's container. Lifestyle management, one on one, but they can track and they said, Now, you know, if your containers on the water, if it's with Maris, then you have to go to the mayor's website, and you can paste, like 1000 pro numbers in their tracking numbers, and it tracks it. But then once it gets the port, that's a separate system. And then once goes from the port, gets translated, you know, onto a truck, everything that's a separate. Portal, but they have all of them, so you can just put your shipment into theirs, and then it gives you tracking data on all but if it's at the port, it has if it's with Maersk, it has it. So that was really interesting. And then the other one, have you heard of Augie?
Danielle Spinelli 20:15
Was the Augment, the AI?
Mark Hiddleson 20:18
Yeah, go augment. And Augie is agent. Did you see? I thought that one was really
Danielle Spinelli 20:22
cool, really cool. Augments, really cool. I would be, I'm excited to see where they really go, because so they got a lot of funding, like, I think it's Series B funding recently, and so it'd be interesting where they're at, like, in a year from now, because they already have really cool tech but like, in a year from now, I think it's going to be like, you know, next level. And now I'm, I am big on, like, AI, like, you know, like I said, I don't think human. I don't think human should be taken out. I'm big on AI and tech helping us, not that. But I think even they have the mindset of its of it will be interacting with humans and not just replacing so that's, that's where I'm at with AI. Anyways, it needs to be where it's they work. CO, pathetically, yeah.
Mark Hiddleson 21:01
So where are some of the so do you deal at all with trans I can't even think of it. What am I? Transload like rail cars, containers going on rail. Do you do a lot with that? Are you familiar with that market, too?
Danielle Spinelli 21:17
So I did a ride along with the California Highway Patrol, their cargo theft task force. So it's like two dudes that handle all of Southern Cal and part of it is the whole Moholy desert. And so they do a lot of the rail stuff. They work with the rail police. So they took me out, like, in the middle of the desert, and showed me all the different like, like, each step had, like, broken seals everywhere on the rail, and then on the side of it was empty boxes everywhere, like you name it, like hookahs Milwaukee or aobi, like you name it, whatever type of freight, there's just empty boxes literally everywhere. And this is the middle of nowhere. And so that was kind of my first time being exposed to the rail side of things and knowing, like, oh, this actually is a huge problem for cargo theft. Like, I had no idea. So just starting to learn about everything I don't know. I'm definitely not an expert, and unfortunately, I feel like real they try to hide a lot of things too, because they want people to keep using it. Yeah, so, you know, I'm trying to dig in, but there's a lot of information that's not given out.
Mark Hiddleson 22:14
So, so question that I'm going to get asked on a podcast, or it's a live cast actually, on Friday, is, how is automation and AI affecting the intermodal? Intermodal is the way. Yeah, it's not trans. I knew it had some trans loading, I guess is what I call when you're loading from, like a container to a truck, yeah, from a ship onto a truck or from, anyways, that's why I was stuck. But yeah, intermodal, how's the AI in that affecting not just the intermodal, but how they interact with, like, the actual warehouses?
Danielle Spinelli 22:49
Oh, interesting. I guess it would mainly be like the even having something automatically read what's coming in, instead of having somebody, you know, jot down, because now they have cameras that can, like, zoom in on the seal number, and they can zoom in on all these things and just having that automatically flow in to check in instead of somebody standing there checking everything in. I think that would, I guess that's the number one thing I can think of, probably the easiest thing to add Teck to.
Mark Hiddleson 23:13
Well, it seems like just a country boy logic. It seems like it's easier to automate that with cameras or readers or scanners, because it trains like a giant conveyor belt to where a highway, it's like you could have on ramps, off ramps, like all these other lanes blocked by other stuff. So I like it that that mode would be easier. And the one thing go ahead,
Danielle Spinelli 23:37
oh, sorry I was gonna say I know the the BNSF, the rail police guys, so they have, like, AI cameras, so in the middle of the desert, so like, if they see a door open, and fling it open, it will alert this their security team to go find that R to see if it's had stolen freight. So I know that's already a thing. Sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt you.
Mark Hiddleson 23:55
About me? No, no, it's, it's my job to keep my mouth shut. So do you have any mistakes like that, even the tell me every on visit the Tell Me Everything episode or anything, big mistakes you've learned from over the years in your career,
Danielle Spinelli 24:13
on a pot, on the podcast, being a host,
Mark Hiddleson 24:17
Tell Me Everything is the thing. So like, would you share any things like, where you learned, like, you made a huge mistake, and then learn something later, yeah, I think
Danielle Spinelli 24:25
The biggest thing that I learned, and this is kind of early on in I guess, life and career, is, you know, thinking that my competitor was my enemy, and, like, not being friends with them. I think that was probably my biggest mistake that I learned, and then shortly thereafter, like, either they changed jobs, or I changed jobs, and then we were, like, literally almost working hand in hand, not a zoom company, but hand in hand. And still had they, they had that stigma on me, and like all that, I don't like her because of this, you know, you just never know who ends up where. So I, luckily, I did learn that on, like, early on in my, you know, early 20s, beginning of my career, and everything. But. That was something that still sticks with me. Sticks with me today, is like, you never know who's gonna work, where and when, and people like, the relationship piece on every part of business is so big. And I think I really think, like, I tell my kids all the time, my daughter's a smarty pants and I'm like, you know, only your brains can, like, get you so far, but the people that you know can get you further.
Mark Hiddleson 25:19
So I. That's, yeah, that is brilliant. That is brilliant. And I had a boss early. I was lucky. The mentors I've had have a boss that told me, early on, take this guy out to coffee. I'm like, taking a guy out for coffee. Yeah, Clark guy, you know what I mean. And, yeah, it was brilliant. Most of those guys were older than me. So I learned a lot, and they were everybody. You'd be surprised how much people will teach you. And I do it now totally. Younger guys call me. I call them teaching them. I was like, you're teaching them all the secrets of the tram like, well, somebody taught me, and it's right, they're, they're more likely to collaborate with me. Like I learned I have my master's degree in holistic health education. Like 20 years ago, I was going to be a life coach, but then I just decided, I'm just going to use this for my own benefit. Yeah, one of the things was collaboration over competition is just like, that's how nature works. That's how relationships really play out. Because as my business has grown, we have a lot of wholesale relationships. So the people who were competitors 20 years ago. They're clients now, because they're buying from us, because we have a lot of inventory that they can buy from sell, and people specialize in different things, right? That's what you're talking about. Like you need. They're a piece of your puzzle. So what's a kind of an example, especially looking at the partnership, looking down the road with GenLogs, who were some of the partners? Like, what's an example of people collaborating with their tech stack? Well, just the, yeah.
Danielle Spinelli 26:47
So like, where I just came from, my care portal, whenever I worked there, because that was kind of how I led into this partnership. Was, I was, I was technically sales in my care portal, but they didn't have a partnership person, so I wore that hat too. And so that's kind of, I guess, the carrier vetting piece is super easy to kind of integrate with. But I think on top of that, like, kind of, what I'm envisioning in my head on, like, what I think would be super cool and like to really nerd out over, is, like, let's say, like, a macro point or a tracking, like, you know, P 44 four kites, whatever, you know, when a tracking is going from A to B, like, not only is it showing on, like, the little dots, like their ELD tracking, or phone tracking, whatever, but then also showing an image of the truck, like, Hey, this is the picture from the side of the truck coinciding with the tracking. So you're like, sending to your receiver ship, or like, Hey, this is the truck you're looking for. He's on track, and it's verified. Like, it's actually verified, not the it's like, the prevention of, kind of like you were talking about, who shows up there at the dock and you're like, checking everything and all that stuff. Well, this will kind of be your secondary piece to be like, Okay, now after I give you the shipment, are you going to take all those placards off and change your identity completely? Because then you won't show up on GenLogs system. And so that's kind of a way to know, like, red flag wise, is like, right away. Hey, I can't, I can't see this guy through GenLogs. Maybe this is a chameleon carrier. Now they're under a different identity. But that's kind of where I envision, like, where all the different types of tech can kind of come together. And it's like, it's really cool to think of, like, Okay, well, what else can we do to enhance this? Or like their products cool, but our stuff could do this and that to it. So it's a, you know, this is kind of like a perfect next step for me, because it's, I'm still, I'm not in sales anymore, which is, which is very weird, because I've been in sales for like, 20 years, but now I'll be into a whole new role where it's like, how do we make the customer's experience be, where you get full visit, you know, like I said, building that fortress up with having all the visibility in one spot.
Mark Hiddleson 28:39
So other than, other than fraud, were some other, yeah, like, just like, the visibility part is huge, and is huge. People keep inventories lower and lower. So she'll share a little bit about why the visibility piece, like, why that's so critical for,
Danielle Spinelli 28:55
yeah, visibility and then even capacity to like, thinking about where trucks are from A to B, and there's a lot of trucks that don't post on load boards, or they're not, you know, sharing where they are, because they're kind of like the good old boys. They got their one shipper, they got their one broker, and that's who has been keeping them in business. Well, how do you get to those guys, right? Yeah, so this is kind of a way to do that, and then just going back to, like, the TMS, for instance. So like, I book a shipment from, you know, a to b, and I assign this carrier to the load, and I'm about to send out a rate confirmation and kind of get them all set up for it. Well, then being able to also tie that into, you know, hey, I also have this capacity here, and being able to, like, route plan it. There's just a ton you can do with having just full cameras everywhere. Like, it's almost like surveillance. And it's so funny. My dad's a huge conspiracy theory guy. So he's like, I can't believe you're, like, working for the enemy with surveillance. So, like, it's actually the future, but whatever you know, but he's like, tinfoil hat.
Mark Hiddleson 29:49
So that's, I'm, like, your dad and I have a tinfoil hat around yours, but, you know, I don't want people spying on me. But then again, I run a business. And I don't want my stuff to get stolen. I want my customer stuff to get stolen. It's like, the same
Danielle Spinelli 30:05
thing as, like, a ring camera, right? Like, I don't want them inside my house, but I'm fine with them. I'm operating legitly, so I'm fine with you watching me go down the road. I think the ones that do have issues with that. You know, I'm like, What are you doing that's making you have a red flag that I'm watching, or like, you're I'm seeing you drive down the road. I mean, if you think about all the cameras that are out there, like governments that use this and straight cameras at it's like, let's give that same technology to the private sector. And even what's interesting is, like, whenever I was working with the California Highway Patrol, and they were, they're actually working on trying to find soil and freight while I was there, and they don't even have, they have to get a warrant to access that information. So they can't even really find a shipment in real time, because they have so many red hoops that they have to jump through just to get to the government's, you know, cameras everywhere. And then by that time that freight is in another, you know, somewhere on a port going overseas, or wherever it's going across, docking here or there. And, you know, it's pretty crazy.
Mark Hiddleson 31:01
Yeah. So we just flew by on the time when I like to ask some personal questions. So besides the Tell Me Everything podcast, what's your favorite podcast?
Danielle Spinelli 31:16
Let's think I like the armchair attorney Matthew Lefler. I love Matthew Lefler because he's a good friend of mine, but before he was a friend, I listened to his show, and he was like, I'm not the smartest person in the world. So whenever he, whenever he, no way, no, this guy is the best part. But he it's fun, because he'll like, okay, like, the the tariff laws that just got reversed, or whatever from on Trump or whatever, he was breaking down to me, like, prior to the whole thing going down, he's like, if this actually happens, I eat, but I think it's called um, whenever, if this actually goes through, like, how much power this would give future presidents, and just because you like the tariffs, and maybe you like Trump or whatever, how this can affect us long term. And so he kind of, like dumbs everything down for me to actually get. So his, his is probably my favorite as like, being able to understand the world and my own way of understanding
Mark Hiddleson 32:11
awesome, the armchair attorney. And what's his name?
Danielle Spinelli 32:14
His name is Matthew Lefler, yeah. So that's probably my favorite one I listen to and then, outside of logistics, I'm a good Joe Rogan fan. Like, that's,
Mark Hiddleson 32:24
I love Joe Rowe, yeah. And he's a conspiracy guy too, but he admits it, like, that's, I know, look, and I know this is because so many of them turn out to be true, you know?
Danielle Spinelli 32:35
Oh, my Yeah, my dad. My dad is a conspiracy theorist, and I like it. So he's also a flat earther. So, and I'm not a flat earther, let's just clarify that. But there's been so many things that he's proven right that I'm like, if one more thing is proven right, I guess there's a flat earth you know? Like, dang it right?
Mark Hiddleson 32:53
Yeah, I've never been able to personally prove it wrong. I've gone halfway around the globe, but never all the way around, yeah, and I've never gotten far away to kind of look back, right? Yeah. Love trust involved in that assumption, right? Well, I always
Danielle Spinelli 33:09
tell him, I'm like, Well, what would be the purpose? And he's got this whole spiel, but it's
Mark Hiddleson 33:13
funny, isn't that incredible? I think I'm happy that there's people out there. They have great arguments to defend. Totally. Yeah, we're not just so naive. Yeah, I'm glad he said, Joe Rogan. I mean, he's a great interviewer. He's like, he practices judo, and I've done a little bit of martial arts, and I'm like, the way he interviews, it's like, judo, yeah, is. And he takes and he blends, and he works within it. I love he's evolved. He's evolved. He's not as tough anymore. He doesn't really get people to, like, totally prove him totally wrong, right?
Danielle Spinelli 33:47
Yeah, no, I love that too. And he's definitely one. Like, I model, I try to model my own podcast around too, like, I love the ying and yang talks that he has. It's not just one sided because sometimes, when you go to some shows and they're just like, bombing them with questions. I'm like, this is an interview. This isn't a podcast, so, yeah,
Mark Hiddleson 34:04
conversation, they're playing gotcha, gotcha journalism, like, get you to make a mistake or trip up on your words. Yeah, that's what I try to do. I try to trip people up. I wasn't able to trip you up.
Danielle Spinelli 34:18
Luckily I do this. Luckily I do this not for a living, but on the side, right? It's not so much work for a podcast. Like, I didn't realize how much work a podcast is, but it's a lot of work.
Mark Hiddleson 34:30
It is in, here's one of the things. So I didn't have time to watch podcasts 10 years ago, but I didn't know what it was I had with a coach. It was actually more in, like, Fitness and Lifestyle, because I'm always trying to do something to stay young longer, and none of it's working. But still snow, skiing, still surf, you know, like, it's still, that's awesome. There were podcasts on, like, a podcast, modcast, you know, and then, but then I started looking, it's like. Wow, really smart people asking the tough questions. You can learn something that could take you 10 years to learn, yeah, in a podcast. And then I started to see how you could connect with other people through a podcast, just the relationships and like, I was a slow adopter to the tech part, but when everything got shut down and I'm a people person. It's like, I need to connect. I want to share energy with other people and learn from them. And so I was working with another business coach, and then just told him about my business, what we do, and my expertise, because there's not a lot of people who have 30 years like either. What they do, what we do. Most people work for a forklift company, like, I think in my competitors, they sell forklifts and they do racking on the side. Well, I sell racking and do podcasts on the side, yeah, but the podcast is built around the relationships, and I've had some amazing clients. Like, they look at my career, people are like, How'd you do it? It's like, just have all these amazing people that I've worked with who've lifted me up. Like, yeah, it wasn't me. It was up to me, you know? Yeah. So, that's cool. So, so share. We got a few more minutes. What is a new tech that you're using right now and then, not like, chat GPT or anything, or, you know, something, it was
Danielle Spinelli 36:16
That gonna be gonna say chat GPT, but new tech I'm using right now. I'm, I mean, I hate to say AI, because we just said not chat, GBT, but there's so many different avenues of AI that I've been using. Like, there's one that I'm kind of sort of trying to build my own AI. I guess it's where you can, like, train it uses, like, open AI. I have to get the name for you, because I can't even think of it at the top of my head, but I'm trying to train it to be like my own mom assistant. Like I'm a mom of three, and they're all three in sports and like, I can't even tell you how many times where my kids are, like, my game starts in 20 minutes. I'm like, almost a vehicle, I know, and I used to be really good at that. Like, whenever my work wasn't so hectic. So like, I need, like, a personal assistant and like a mom assist, like a nanny, but not, you know, a virtual nanny to, like, tell me all the things I need to do, or, like, Hey, you're you need to buy this. And luckily, I have the fridge that has, like, the camera, like you think, so I'm trying to build it where, like, it syncs up with all that stuff. I don't know what the heck I'm doing, but I'm watching a lot of videos. So that's like my new tech that I want, that they need to build that for me. But in the meantime, I'll try to figure it out myself. So is it like a
Mark Hiddleson 37:28
digital twin? I've got some people that they're talking about digital twins. Is that where it's like, have you heard of the word digital twin? Like? So it is kind of like what you're saying to you, and it's another good reason for the podcast, because you can use information off the podcast to build the digital twin. So yeah, it's the International Society of service, innovation professionals. Is something that I joined. It's free to join but it's people. It's kind of a bridge between academia and business, and so a lot of leading research in his people who are professors and inventors and people in that they also want to connect with business people who, like, people who are building stuff, yeah, digital twin. I've never heard of it, but they're, they're working on, but it's similar to what, yeah.
Danielle Spinelli 38:17
I mean, I'd love to, like, take, I have a second part of my brain, but, like, one that can focus and not be ADHD mind, but I want to be ADHD mind, you know, and talk,
Mark Hiddleson 38:26
yeah, a friend of mine wrote a book, and it's really good. I wrote a book. It took me nine years. He wrote a book in like six months. I'm so jealous, like, it's really good. And he jumps around everything. He goes, he was going to call it Barry's babble. And he goes, I think I'm calling. I'm gonna call now. I'm gonna say, hey, look, there goes a squirrel. Look, squirrel. And I'm like, That's me, but like, for me, Oh, totally. Like, I'll be in the middle of a conversation, I'll go, Oh, look at that hawk. And just like, I kind
Danielle Spinelli 38:55
I love that. Yeah, I think most of us in the industry, though, are ADHD, like, I think it's the majority like, that's where we all have come from. And we all end up there because we're, we can't, like being a logistic or supply chain. You have to be multitasking, like a guru, and that comes with, like, being ADHD. So that's and we're all people, people, most of the time, you know, like a lot of us are, we play hard, but we, you know, work hard, play harder, type things. A lot of us in the industry, or at least that conference, the ones that go to conferences are the ones that go to conferences like that.
Mark Hiddleson 39:25
So yeah, so share your favorite conference, besides manifest. I mean, the manifest was off the chart. I'm interviewing Katie day on Friday, and that's another conference.
Danielle Spinelli 39:35
Um, so honestly, I like the smaller ones. So I work a lot with, like, TMS companies. So I like the ones that are TMS because they're very similar, their customer base is very intimate, so it's not like sales pitch. They just are there to learn, but then you can learn from them. So I like that one, and then I'll pitch two other ones. Once the car travelers were always talking about cargo theft, but it's so good. It's Monrovia, California. Um. On, like, usually in October every year, and it is, like, mind blowing. I walk away learning so much, and usually I know most of the things about it. But this, that one, I was like, couldn't write down fast enough different things. So that was a really good one. And then I also, like Tia, just being on the brokerage side of things, the TIA conference, like their big annual one, it's super fun. Like, the nightlife is the best, so awesome, and that's the most important part.
Mark Hiddleson 40:24
Yeah, it really is. We call it poolside logistics, one on one. We've always, like, the best conversations, the best relationships, everything starts either at the pool or the bar. Yeah, totally, if the pool has a bar.
Danielle Spinelli 40:35
Yeah, exactly, yeah. No, totally true. I think that's where I mean, being in sales for so long, too. That was like, like, I didn't have to really attend the floor or be sitting at the booth all day long. I got just as many leads after hours. You know, being best friends with them. A lot of times, I'd become good friends with somebody, and then, like, after we'd get back home, they'd be like, now, what do you do? And I'm like, Oh yeah, I guess, I guess I should tell you that,
Mark Hiddleson 40:57
yeah, the people, one thing I've noticed about manifest people follow up. I mean, I forget, yeah, you follow up with me. You reached out on LinkedIn. Or I forget, I'm pretty sure, and I wanted to follow up with you anyways. But there's a few I've had the guys from Gnosis follow up on, then I had a few. So I'm really stoked. So what's the best way for people to get a hold of you? Where do you want them to go? Obviously, your LinkedIn will have that posted.
Danielle Spinelli 41:20
I guess LinkedIn is probably the best. LinkedIn, yeah, LinkedIn, so either me or my Tell Me Everything page, either way, but kind of or both, actually, because I share mostly just podcasts on one thing I try not to make, or my feeds just totally my podcast. But yeah, anything you know, reach out to me on LinkedIn. DM me. I got a lot of people messaging me on that. If you guys know of any fraud trends in your industry, hit me up, because I'm here to learn dynamite.
Mark Hiddleson 41:47
I want to be the first to thank you. Danielle, this has been absolute pleasure. I learned a ton. And thank you so much
Speaker 1 41:53
for joining. Yeah, thank you. It's been really fun. Thanks for listening to the podcast. We'll see you again next time, and be sure to click Subscribe to get future episodes you.
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